ITT: Pretend we are still writing in osu! OT

fittan · ^

Brian OA wrote:

dead

ya i was away hi

Brian OA · ^

Welcome back

What were you up tp

fittan · ^

i was in china it was pretty neat

▼Hidden text

Last edited by fittan (2019-06-16 09:00:12)

Brian OA · ^

I have several questions

fittan · ^

i can answer a lot of them

tupsu · ^

did they molest you on the way back in the airport
I suppose the more serious question is, was there really aggressive border control, like for example did they tell you to give them your social media a la USA

fittan · ^

tupsu wrote:

did they molest you on the way back in the airport
I suppose the more serious question is, was there really aggressive border control, like for example did they tell you to give them your social media a la USA

no social media, just the passport and visa.

Brian OA · ^

So what is this drop down to be cautious of in a bathroom and why does it have a safety belt

fittan · ^

Brian OA wrote:

So what is this drop down to be cautious of in a bathroom and why does it have a safety belt

there's a sewer entrance next to the entrance to the toilet

fittan · ^

Opinions ahead (can't believe i have to fucking state that online these days albeit generally not so much near you people but there's the occasional moron):

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/06/13/1 … ave-pride/

1. Gay conversion therapy is still legal in the UK
>why can't the government just force parents to want normal children

2. Trans prisoners are put in the wrong prisons
>why can't the government just force penintentiaries to be daycare centres

3. Gay and bi men can’t donate blood for three months after having sex
>why can't the government just spend a fuckton of extra money to test the blood every time persons who are more likely to carry blood-borne sexually transmitted infections want to give blood

4. There’s no non-binary gender option on passports
>why can't the government let me be imaginary
edit: forgot to respond to this one
i can kind of get behind the third gender option, but read 15 where i go into the topic

5. HIV-prevention drug PrEP is not widely available
>why can't the government just spend a fuckton of extra money to make sure persons who are more likely to carry blood-borne sexually transmitted infections are less likely to receive sexually transmitted infections and just let them be sexual deviants
obviously only applies to some, you know what a manwhore is. still find it hilarious to be placed in the same article as #3

6. No central London LGBT+ venues are fully accessible
>why can't the government just force businesses that specifically cater to us to cater to crippled members of us too?
this one is genuinely hilarious

7. Intersex babies are operated on by the NHS
>why can't the government just force parents to let their children be bullied for being born defective
imagine the changing room after physical education in primary and high school

8. Gay marriage is still illegal in Northern Ireland
this i have no qualms with, though please do never ever force a priest to marry a couple they deem against their religion. i do know you can get married without a church wedding, which should be legal for everyone above the age of eighteen.

9. Sex education doesn’t teach LGBT+ relationships
no qualms again, but much like religious studies (we have(/had?) them in school in finland) parents should get to choose whether or not their child has to attend sex-ed classes which teach these lessons.

10. LGBT+ people can’t travel safely on public transport
cherrypicking because recent event, this one's low

11. Teaching kids that LGBT+ people exist has caused protests in two cities
>why can't the government force people to have their children be brainwashed to be tolerant
literally let parents bring up their children how they want to with the aide of the school. if it's against the moral values of citizens, it's not to be compulsory to be taught at school.

12. In Northern Ireland, trans people can be legally discriminated against
>why can't the government be forced to house me

Backstory:

Trans people in Northern Ireland also have problems in applying for social housing as transphobia is not recognised by the Housing Executive, on housing application forms, to gain social housing points.

not much to say, from what i gather they're mad that non-crippling mental illness isn't an excuse to get cheap rent from the government

13. Sexuality and gender identity aren’t included in the census
>why can't the government highlight how special i am
it shouldn't matter, are you trying to show that you exist? we can already tell without you needing to let the entire world know, don't worry.
i've always hated bringing up sexuality and personally in real life operate on a don't-ask-don't-tell mentality

14. 24% of homeless young people are LGBT+
>why can't the government force my family to accept who i am
violence is never cool and neither is people losing their houses, but it's not illegal to force your (adult) offspring to go their own way.

Backstory:

The study found that the main reasons were parental rejection, abuse within the family or being exposed to aggression and violence. Among the most prevalent outcomes of LGBT people becoming homeless were sexual exploitation and mental health issues, alongside homophobic bullying and alcohol abuse.

-----

>why can't the government force people to donate to charities that exist to provide low-cost housing for me
as seen before (in Northern Ireland), there are more pressing reasons to get social housing than being LGBT and the government is already busy giving mohammed and a junkie with a family the social housing. the charities that went under are just that and they went under or had to cut funding because they lack money. this is because they suck at what they do or people don't want to donate to them for personal reasons which is fine.

Backstory:

“In 2016, we saw the closure of two key delivery partners – Pace and Broken Rainbow – and we saw our own funding cut,” says Lucille Power of Stonewall Housing. The organisation has established a relationship with L&Q housing association in London.

15. The Gender Recognition Act still hasn’t been reformed
>why can't the government force acceptance that i'm wimmin now
biological gender is and should be what the proof of identity of a person states. we are what we're born as and choose our way after that (hopefully not before reaching the age of adulthood when we're in every other way allowed to legally make our own decisions, i've always felt it fucking retarded that tattoos, marriage and sex change among other permanent changes should somehow be exceptions). it is my view that sex change is body modification, like tattoos and piercings. if we're more comfortable that way, go for it. still shouldn't change the passport.

Last edited by fittan (2019-06-18 18:32:39)

tupsu · ^

1) what is 'normal' is subjective bullshit and there is no way to define it. also, gay conversion therapy is most often highly traumatic, at times features shit like electric shocks, and has little to no scientific proof behind it. parents aren't allowed to traumatise their kids for any other reason in the UK as far as I'm aware.
2) there shouldn't be any difference between male and female prisons anyway and trans prisoners are more likely to face harassment/violence in prisons of the gender they don't identify with, which isn't exactly the point of imprisonment. why not take measures to reduce prison violence
3) the blood is tested every time anyway though; the behaviour of a minority inside a community (even if that minority is a larger percentage in that community than the general community) shouldn't be used to paint the entire community
note that I actually don't have strong opposition against the 3 month ban because statistics (it's a problem that should be treated in the MSM communities via awareness and encouragement to use more protection), but there are some countries which ban it for a year/possibly even forever, which is just absurd
4) some people feel immense discomfort about being labelled either gender, I do not see why someone should be forced to go through that just because 'muh traditional categories'. biological sex and gender identity are two wholly different concepts, which is seen already through the variety of gender presentation across genders themselves (oversimplified: not all vagina owners wear pink dresses on a daily basis, etc.) also, quite literally, people who do not fit into either category exist; trying to fit a circle into a sorting system of triangles and squares will probably not end well
5) I agree it doesn't need to be subsidised (with certain exceptions that have little to do with gay men), but there should be out-of-pocket availability ensured. also it is a matter of public health and likely cheaper than the NHS having to provide antiretrovirals for NHS instead
6) I mean, it's fact for a number of other public services? I agree it's not the government's issue though, the individual places should be pushed to provide accessibility
7) why the fuck would you ever have your genitals out in a school's changing room? also, why the fuck should a bullying victim be blamed for *being different* rather than the bullies for being dipshits?
often with intersex people it's a 50/50 cointoss of what gender they identify with, and if the doctors/parents happen to get it wrong, it's quite the adventure to in essence reverse a gender reassignment surgery years after the fact. let people decide what bits they feel like they should have, it's no one else's business
8) meh, yeah, about the same opinion
9) I disagree with parent-based sheltering - people can have opinions on what their child is taught and how they feel about it, but as long as the curriculum is neutral and simply explains the existence of these groups, it shouldn't be opt-in or opt-out. to me, it vaguely resembles the concept of trying to hide from your kid that Asians exist or something
10) targeted violence is an issue but this seems very out of place in this list yes
11) how is it against someone's moral values that certain people exist? if I decide that the existence of Jewish people goes against my moral values, should that give me reason to demand they don't get mentioned anywhere ever?
12) if someone was refused housing because they were/identified as a woman (cis for the sake of the example), or because they were x nationality/ethnicity, I have a feeling you'd feel otherwise about it. any kind of non-changeable trait (and yes, gender identity is non-changeable in my opinion) should not be a valid ground for refusing someone government services
13) I mean, it's pretty relevant information for the government to know; iirc our census collects that data. it is also quite relevant for interest groups to know that information, nothing about highlighting them or being special
14) this is a vague thing where causation can't really be proven, I don't really know how to address this in any sensible way. it's unfortunate that GSM people are kicked out more frequently but that's more of an indication that maybe general views on the matter should be changing so that parents would stop kicking their kids out
15) first of all, any complaints about changing the act are pretty moot at this point considering there have already been several promises by the government to do that, but nothing has actually happened yet.
as for the contents itself, yes the government should allow people to change their gender considering gender-sex mismatch has been shown to be quite common at this point. the UK specifically has a fucking draconic system with that currently, hence why that act should be reformed. having an official document state that you are something you are not can feel like you are having your identity stripped away from you, and it quite clearly contributes to the general misery trans people experience if unable to transition.
moreover, why the fuck would anyone need an official document on what genitalia you happen to possess/what hormones your body produces? doctors, sure, but that's a pretty common-sense thing to mention to your doctor (and disclosing that to your doctors is advocated for by just about every sane person trans or not).
I also can't tell what exactly you're saying with the tattoos and marriage point, so if you want me to complain about that you might want to clarify that.
imo people shouldn't be changing their gender before 18 no (or even a bit after that tbh), but puberty blockers have been shown to be a safe alternative that reduces overall misery/dysphoria and enables transitioning to be easier for those that go through it after the fact (and if it turns out the person changes their mind, they just stop taking the blockers and experience puberty late).

glossary:
MSM = men who have sex with men
cis = "not trans" ie sex matches gender
sex = biological ie what genitals you have
gender = what you feel like you should be
GSM = gender and sexual minorities, automatically encompasses everything as opposed to the LGBT+ letter soup

Granger · ^

based

fittan · ^

Granger wrote:

based

highly insightful input on a political debate. i doubt you saw anything but 'homo bad trans bad vote 4 hitler deus vult xd' in anything i wrote but feel free to give your input if you change your mind and want to have a respectful debate.

tupsu wrote:

1) what is 'normal' is subjective bullshit and there is no way to define it. also, gay conversion therapy is most often highly traumatic, at times features shit like electric shocks, and has little to no scientific proof behind it. parents aren't allowed to traumatise their kids for any other reason in the UK as far as I'm aware.

Electric shocks/violence aren't prevalent, they're practically talking about bible camps and psychiatric treatment and more often than not, it's the latter. If you're referring to something like this article: it happened in the '90s. You think it's not a long time ago, but times have very much changed. I find plenty of evidence online of it having happened, but not in recent years. It saves children from domestic violence.

tupsu wrote:

2) there shouldn't be any difference between male and female prisons anyway and trans prisoners are more likely to face harassment/violence in prisons of the gender they don't identify with, which isn't exactly the point of imprisonment. why not take measures to reduce prison violence

I'm more for throwing prosecuted criminals into one pit and letting them rot; I have no sympathy for anyone in prison. Yes, I know persons who are or have been incarcerated.

tupsu wrote:

3) the blood is tested every time anyway though; the behaviour of a minority inside a community (even if that minority is a larger percentage in that community than the general community) shouldn't be used to paint the entire community
note that I actually don't have strong opposition against the 3 month ban because statistics (it's a problem that should be treated in the MSM communities via awareness and encouragement to use more protection), but there are some countries which ban it for a year/possibly even forever, which is just absurd

Ample time for risk groups to realise they carry an STI should be enforced to lower the overall contamination of blood. I won't get into the culture and crime rate relations statistics when it comes to immigration, but it's a good analogy as I concur with the overall idea of both that and this. Take that as you wish.

tupsu wrote:

4) some people feel immense discomfort about being labelled either gender, I do not see why someone should be forced to go through that just because 'muh traditional categories'. biological sex and gender identity are two wholly different concepts, which is seen already through the variety of gender presentation across genders themselves (oversimplified: not all vagina owners wear pink dresses on a daily basis, etc.) also, quite literally, people who do not fit into either category exist; trying to fit a circle into a sorting system of triangles and squares will probably not end well

Unironically I still think this:

If we're speaking metaphors, the perfect circle is insanely rare and the triangularly-shaped spheroid can be altered to be a triangle, while the rectangularly-shaped spheroid can be altered to be a rectangle. It's up to the parents, they have the power to decive about their child until it turns 18.

tupsu wrote:

5) I agree it doesn't need to be subsidised (with certain exceptions that have little to do with gay men), but there should be out-of-pocket availability ensured. also it is a matter of public health and likely cheaper than the NHS having to provide antiretrovirals for NHS instead

I should have specified there should be no distinction between sexual orientation here. Give condoms intead.

tupsu wrote:

6) I mean, it's fact for a number of other public services? I agree it's not the government's issue though, the individual places should be pushed to provide accessibility

Not by the government. By the clientele, if they so desire.

tupsu wrote:

7) why the fuck would you ever have your genitals out in a school's changing room? also, why the fuck should a bullying victim be blamed for *being different* rather than the bullies for being dipshits?
often with intersex people it's a 50/50 cointoss of what gender they identify with, and if the doctors/parents happen to get it wrong, it's quite the adventure to in essence reverse a gender reassignment surgery years after the fact. let people decide what bits they feel like they should have, it's no one else's business

Yeah you've never been into the boys' changing room (it has the showers obviously) in school. It was a warzone with all the dicks hanging and towels slapping. We also pissed on one another in the showers.

tupsu wrote:

9) I disagree with parent-based sheltering - people can have opinions on what their child is taught and how they feel about it, but as long as the curriculum is neutral and simply explains the existence of these groups, it shouldn't be opt-in or opt-out. to me, it vaguely resembles the concept of trying to hide from your kid that Asians exist or something

I believe parents should be allowed to decide on their childrens' subjects on religious grounds. It's incredibly atheist of a society to force people to go against their respective religious scriptures.

tupsu wrote:

11) how is it against someone's moral values that certain people exist? if I decide that the existence of Jewish people goes against my moral values, should that give me reason to demand they don't get mentioned anywhere ever?

Nobody's denying the existence of LGBT or wanting to hide their existence. It's about teaching that what is defined by someone's religion as sin is normal. I think we need to very clearly define that I believe in freedom of (every (major)) religion and letting one's religion dictate their life choices if one so desires. No, I'm not a biblefag.

tupsu wrote:

12) if someone was refused housing because they were/identified as a woman (cis for the sake of the example), or because they were x nationality/ethnicity, I have a feeling you'd feel otherwise about it. any kind of non-changeable trait (and yes, gender identity is non-changeable in my opinion) should not be a valid ground for refusing someone government services

They're not by definition in a poor socioeconomic situation and if they have no background of being in one, they go to the back of the queue.

tupsu wrote:

13) I mean, it's pretty relevant information for the government to know; iirc our census collects that data. it is also quite relevant for interest groups to know that information, nothing about highlighting them or being special

I'll agree to me not knowing enough on this one, I don't know the application of aggregating overall sexual orientation other than trying to normalise it.

tupsu wrote:

14) this is a vague thing where causation can't really be proven, I don't really know how to address this in any sensible way. it's unfortunate that GSM people are kicked out more frequently but that's more of an indication that maybe general views on the matter should be changing so that parents would stop kicking their kids out

Yeah, I agree. You can't force a parent to accept their child but I think it's really fucked up not to accept them.

tupsu wrote:

15) first of all, any complaints about changing the act are pretty moot at this point considering there have already been several promises by the government to do that, but nothing has actually happened yet.
as for the contents itself, yes the government should allow people to change their gender considering gender-sex mismatch has been shown to be quite common at this point. the UK specifically has a fucking draconic system with that currently, hence why that act should be reformed. having an official document state that you are something you are not can feel like you are having your identity stripped away from you, and it quite clearly contributes to the general misery trans people experience if unable to transition.
moreover, why the fuck would anyone need an official document on what genitalia you happen to possess/what hormones your body produces? doctors, sure, but that's a pretty common-sense thing to mention to your doctor (and disclosing that to your doctors is advocated for by just about every sane person trans or not).
I also can't tell what exactly you're saying with the tattoos and marriage point, so if you want me to complain about that you might want to clarify that.
imo people shouldn't be changing their gender before 18 no (or even a bit after that tbh), but puberty blockers have been shown to be a safe alternative that reduces overall misery/dysphoria and enables transitioning to be easier for those that go through it after the fact (and if it turns out the person changes their mind, they just stop taking the blockers and experience puberty late).

>having an official document state that you are something you are not can feel like you are having your identity stripped away from you
I've tried to understand genuine gender dysphoria and I've interviewed transpersons about this but I've never managed to understand how it's so bad to admit that you were born in another gender than the one in which you decide to present yourself. It's literally just a passport and its purpose is to identify you as what you are and however you modify yourself (which is cool by me, by the way) you're going to be what you were born as. I can't see gender identity crisis being anything but a snowball effect, especially with how common it has become in recent years.

>I also can't tell what exactly you're saying with the tattoos and marriage point, so if you want me to complain about that you might want to clarify that.
Just the bit where such big decisions should be adult decisions. I went on a bit too long trying to drive across literally nothing.

Also, puberty blockers don't make someone fertile. Everyone knows transitioning will make one a surgical replica at best, never a complete version of the opposite gender.

Last edited by fittan (2019-06-19 15:09:07)

fittan · ^

Apparently on my theme the picture I made isn't very effective as the circle behind the square has a very similar colour to the background. Open it in a new tab or something if you're using a dark theme.

Edit: holy shit i actually accidentally picked the literal same colour for the circle as the background of posts in the cobalt theme is. that's incredible

Last edited by fittan (2019-06-19 15:08:42)

Brian OA · ^

Granger wrote:

based

I dream of a world where based is word filtered with epic win

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